Ricoh GR Digital III, f/3.2, 1/1250 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 100, 0.0 EV
Introduction
Those who regularly visit my blog know that I prefer to use small sensor cameras for my photography. These cameras are much smaller than dSLR’s and therefore easier to take with you. But the most important reason for me is the way they can draw. For me they create instant sketches. It is something I like, I prefer. Of course I can appreciate a beautiful photograph from a larger sensor camera, but I just like black and white sort of sketches and I think small sensors are really suitable for that.
The previous cameras I wrote about are the Ricoh GX100 and GX200, and the Sigma DP1. From all these cameras my favorite camera has always been the GX100 even though it had some technical flaws. But the one camera I always wanted to use was the Ricoh GR Digital. When the GX100 was introduced (nearly two years after the release of the GR Digital I) I opted for the GX100, because of its more versatile lens and the improved speed with RAW photography. The older GR Digital I had writing times of 12 seconds while the GX100 could reach 6 seconds with a fast SD card. But often I thought I still should have picked up the GR Digital I instead.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/4, 1/250 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 64, -0.7 EV
Why? Because I have photographed so long with the original GR camera, the GR1 (this is a film camera). I loved the handling and the wonderful 28 mm lens. So it should have been the most logical digital equivalent of my analogue camera. Many still think the B&W jpegs are still very special (although that hasn’t convinced me) and I seemed to like color photographs too. In particular with low and mixed light photography the auto white balance seemed to be unpredictable and resulted in wonderful photographs with pretty amazing colors. Some of the best examples I found here from Hong Kong based photographer Nacoki.
But the fact is that I was too rational in my thinking and instead opted for the GX100. Still a wonderful camera and it served me really well (well almost for a year, before it was replaced by Ricoh with a GX200), but……
So when I got in contact with Ricoh this year I requested a test sample of the new Ricoh GR Digital III. I really wanted to know if this camera would still bring the feeling of the glory days I had with the GR1, a camera that became a cult camera, especially in Japan. At Rangefinderforum.com for instance the camera is still being raved by many of its owners or those who had one.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/3.2, 1/1000 sec, 21mm equivalent, ISO 100, -0.7 EV
History
So for those not familiar with this camera and the history of the GR series the first GR was announced in October 1996, the GR1. It is a high quality compact camera build with outstanding materials like a tough and light magnesium body. And the 28mm fixed wide angle lens was considered one of the best for that price. The Ricoh GR1 competed with other, mostly Japanese, high quality compact camera like the Nikon 28Ti and 35Ti (Ti referring to the titanium body), Konica Hexar AF, Contax T1/T2 (and later the TvS series), Minolta TC1, and the Leica CM and the Minilux series. All these cameras had sophistaced metering systems that could be found in SLR cameras to get accurate exposures with slide film. And the fixed focal length lenses could compete with there SLR equivalents.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/3.2, 1/200 sec, 21mm equivalent, ISO 64, 0.0 EV
Unfortunately though it seems that this niche market is something of the past with the exception of the Sigma DP1, DP2 and the upcoming Leica X1. Some could argue that the current serious compact cameras fill in this niche market, but in my opinion the Ricoh GR Digital is the only camera that currently fulfills that legacy. Not to say that other cameras are not as good, they might well be. But it is just that Ricoh hold truth to the principles of the GR series and to the basics of this particular niche market. And that is a high quality compact camera with exclusive materials and a superb fixed focal length lens. So here I am with the new Ricoh GR Digital III.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/1.9, 1/320 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 64, 0.0 EV
To start with
Not too long ago I posted my first and rather short impression of this camera. I mentioned that I really liked the finish of this camera. The non-slippery surface together with the usual Ricoh ergonomics makes this camera very enjoyable to hold in the hand. It is lightweight and very durable too. Another great feature of this camera is the new and much faster lens with a maximum opening of f/1.9! That used to be f/2.4 with the previous versions. It is now the fastest lens you can find on any compact camera which is an impressive achievement in my opinion.
I welcome Ricoh to follow the new trend started with the Panasonic DMC-LX3 to decrease the amount of pixels on the sensor. Instead of another sensor with 12 megapixels, they acquired a 10 megapixel sensor.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/3.2, 1/800 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 100, 0.0 EV
Another amazing aspect of this camera is how you can customize this camera. Many buttons and dials can be reassigned, so you will likely find a set up that matches your style of camera handling. Like the GX200 it can register up to 3 personal settings. And new is the shutter speed mode that was requested by many GRD-users in the past.
The camera can be bought with many accessories like optical viewfinders and an add-on conversion lens. There is a viewfinder with 28 mm matching frame lines, the GV-2, and there is a larger optical viewfinder, the GV-1, that not only has the 28mm frame lines, but also the 21mm that can be used in combination with the GW-2 21mm conversion lens. I have been using this camera with the GV-1 viewfinder and found it a joy to use it. Shortly before finishing this writing I finally got the GW-2 lens too so I could extent my impression of the camera. As a result of the new lens design and the changed diameter for the adapter Ricoh skipped the 40mm conversion lens that was available for the GR Digital I and GR Digital II. I still do hope they come up with a new design.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/3.5, 1/200 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 100, 0.0 EV
Unfortunately this joy doesn’t come cheap. The camera and accessories will cost you a lot of money. Together with the Leica D-Lux 4 it is one of the most expensive small sensor cameras on the market. But don’t be fooled. The high quality materials and the lens makes this an expensive camera and I think it is worth it (in 1996 I paid something like €490,- for this camera and that is without 13 years of inflation correction!).
I have said it before in the short impression, but I think the LCD screen is a bit too large. The designers had to move the buttons more to the right. Maybe this is still usable for Japanese hands, but I regularly accidentally touched the display or macro button when I walked around with the camera. On the other hand the LCD screen is incredibly sharp and very clear and probably one of the most usable in bright conditions too.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/3.2, 1/1600 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 100, 0.0 EV
In depth – ouch!
With every new camera released we of course have the anticipation that the camera will be better than the previous one. Now, I can’t compare the camera to the GR Digital II and the original GR Digital I, but I do have my knowledge with two generations of GX cameras. In my impression of the GX200 I stated that the GX200 DNG’s (RAW images) couldn’t be processed in the same way I used to do with the GX100 DNG’s. In particular darkening the luminance of the blue channel resulted in excessive noise and blotches. That seriously limited my B&W conversion techniques. It was most visible with Adobe Lightroom and Adobe ACR, and to lesser extent with Silkypix. Unfortunately the DNG’s from the GR Digital III form no exception. And while the GR Digital III performs better than the GX200 at higher ISO’s the images are quite soft, even at ISO 100. There is more smearing and less detail going on in the GR Digital III DNG’s and even more so with the jpegs. It surprised me, because I had much better expectations with the arrival of the new sensor which is slightly larger and has less pixels. Besides that I am not really enthusiastic about the results from Adobe Lightroom and Adobe ACR for the RAW conversion. I happen to get the best results with the most pleasing amount of details from RAW Therapee. RAW Developer for the Mac does a pretty good job too with the DNG’s (many thanks to Amin Sabet from Serious Compacts for verifying). Even Silkypix, which has often be considered the best RAW converter for the Ricoh DNG’s couldn’t achieve the same results as RAW Therapee. The only issue I have with RAW Therapee is that it is slow and uses a lot of memory.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/3.5, 1/1000 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 100, 0.0 EV
Now there are 100% image quality comparisons popping up all over the net and it seems the GR Digital III isn’t the best performer when compared to cameras like the Panasonic LX3 and the Canon G10/G11. If you think these comparisons are vital for your final deciding than that is fine with me, but in my opinion these comparisons makes no sense at all for real world photography. I mean, start making prints to see the differences. And when you just enjoy sharing your photographs online than ask yourself if those 100% image comparisons makes any differences when you post your photographs at a max of 1024 pixels.
While finishing my article Ricoh updated the firmware for the GR Digital III on September 30 to version 1.21. I updated the camera and repeated some of my test. While using the GW-2 conversion lens and manual focus at infinity with an aperture of f/5.0 resulted in soft backgrounds before the update, but had no problems after the update. I also saw strange streaks when I used the magnification feature on the LCD screen for manual focusing, some even mentioned that the magnification turned black. The update resolved this problem.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/3.2, 1/320 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 100, 0.0 EV
But!
Now I have said that, I should start mentioning that this camera however is so good in many other departments. The lens is very good, even at f/1.9. And the lens can actually give the photographs some shallow depth of field for nearby subjects (up to 2 to 3 meters and closer). The fast lens gives the camera the edge in low light photography and I found the images very usable up to ISO 800, although some will probably like the ISO 1600 performance too. I thought it wasn’t bad, but almost never used it. The noise is rather nicely and unevenly distributed, although there is some vertical banding at higher ISO’s. Since I am not interested in shadow details I found this not an issue for me. Ricoh seemed to have improved the dynamic range too. Both the DNG’s and the jpegs seem to hold more subtleties and the tonality is finer than with the GX200.
The camera has several metering systems, including a multi exposure metering system, center weighted and a spot metering system. I personally felt comfortable with center weighted, but thought it was good to have spot metering at hand for whenever needed.
Unlike larger sensors smaller sensors do have more light sensitivity. You need to be careful with exposing and it is often best to be on the defensive site. The new sensor for the GR Digital III looks even more sensitive, so at times it is best to underexpose -0.3 to -0.7 EV. to avoid harsh clipped highlights. But be warned anyway. Small sensor cameras have less dynamic range, so it comes down to making choices. Dark shadows and properly exposed highlights, or shadow details and clipped highlights.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/2.5, 1/2000 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 100, -0.3 EV
But what makes this camera unique is that it is actually a system that can be expanded. The available accessories are all of high quality. The GV-1 viewfinder is very large and bright with clear frame lines that can even be used by those wearing glasses. The GW-2 lens delivers incredible performances and adds a nice weight and balance to the camera. I also liked using the camera with the adapter and hood (GH-2). It makes the camera very easy to handle, in particular with the optical viewfinder, although that won’t make the camera pocketable anymore. To see all the available options check here.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/1.9, 1/710 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 200, +0.3 EV
Usability
The most important aspect that makes Ricoh cameras distinctive from its competitors is the user interface. The first class hand grip and the easy to reach buttons and dials. I can easily change some settings without even looking.
I already talked about the customizability of this camera. And I am surprised to see the efforts Ricoh have made to make this camera special for every owner. Ricoh cameras are regarded as great cameras for street photography, because of the excellent snap mode. When the snap focus is activated, the camera immediately set focus for 2.5 meter which significantly reduces the shutter lag. But guess what? They improved that and now you can set your preference focus distance for the snap mode with options for 1, 2.5 (default) or 5 meter and infinity. You can do this in the menu by changing the snap focus distance, but you can also change it while photographing. Just keep the “up” button pressed and use the front dial to set the focus distance. Quick and easy.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/1.9, 1/1620 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 100, -0.3 EV
The GR Digital III has two function buttons that can be reassigned to your personal preferences. Even the zoom button can be assigned to three functions including the exposure compensation. And what I also liked was to reassign the front dial to the shutter speed and the rear dial for aperture when using the camera in manual mode. Something that is normally vice versa.
When you use the camera with an optical viewfinder you can switch the LCD screen off. People already marveled the new Leica X1 for having a AF confirmation light on the back that can be seen while viewing through the viewfinder, but the GR Digital cameras have had this for ages. And when you have the LCD screen turned off it can still show your settings when you change the exposure.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/1.9, 1/12 sec, 21mm equivalent, ISO 400, -0.3 EV
Sorry for those interest in modern day features like face detection systems and image stabilization. You won’t find it, but don’t be worried either. Your experience will make the difference with this camera. And since the camera has a wide angle lens I didn’t miss the image stabilization. But to be fair and honest, I never use it either for my Ricoh GX200.
Conclusion
I must say that I am impressed with the Ricoh GR Digital III. I have some concerns with the image quality. The images appear softer (especially the jpegs) and processing the DNG’s in many RAW converters causes quite noisy and blotchy results. Maybe this can be fixed with a firmware update, but in the meantime I suggest using RAW Therapee or RAW Developer (only Mac). These issues might be a real problem for you when you mostly enjoy images at 100% magnification, but I find it less of a problem when you print your photographs or when you mostly publish and share your photographs online.
For the hefty price you get a unique camera with an amazing lens. No zoom, so to zoom you need to get closer or take more distance. It brings photography back to the essence in my opinion. You need to think harder and you become more careful with your framing.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/3.2, 1/760 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 64, +0.3 EV
But you also get the excellent Ricoh support and regular firmware updates until the camera is being replaced by a new one. In fact, the latest firmware usually introduces some newest features of the new camera in the older one too. A bonus you won’t likely get from other manufacturers.
Despite some minor flaws I described above and the fact that the camera has only a fixed focal length lens (28mm while I started to prefer 35mm with my GX200) I will absolutely miss this camera when it is returned to Ricoh. I only used my GX200 for some boring comparison shots, but always had the GR Digital III with me for the last couple of weeks. When I would be in the same position like 2.5 years ago I would definitely and instantly pick up the GR Digital III instead of the GX200.
Alternatives
I have said that the Ricoh GR Digital III is a very unique camera designed and targeted for a very specific type of photographer. While there used to be some vibrant competition in the nineties, things don’t look the same anymore nowadays. The only real competition comes from Sigma with their DP1. This is the only other camera on the market with a 28mm fixed focal length lens, although a quite slow lens starting at f/4.0, but comes with a much larger sensor. As expected this camera produces much better image quality, but comes short in terms of user usability in my opinion. More than any other camera it is a camera to be mastered. It is a much slower camera, and I found manual focusing hardly usable with the mediocre screen. It does however work well with zone focusing and it makes the camera more responsive too. It takes however at least 6 seconds to write an image to the card which I think is very slow for todays standards. Prices did drop enormously, so it could be an attractive camera, and an update of the camera will soon hit the shelves, the DP1s. The DP1s will have some of the improved technologies from the DP2, but I don’t expect a major leap forward.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/1.9, 1/15 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 400, +0.7 EV
Not quite comparable, but with a fixed focal length are the Sigma DP2 (41mm lens) and the to be released Leica X1 (36mm). Both these cameras have a larger sensor (dSLR size!), but all come at a considerably higher price (the Leica will cost $2,000!).
The only other cameras to consider are some of the better and more advanced serious compact cameras. The first one comes from the same Ricoh house, the GX200. The camera comes with a moderate zoom range, 24 to 72mm, and shares many of the GRD technologies. Read my previous impression of this camera to find out more about it. The lens isn’t as fast as the GR Digital III and it isn’t the best performer at higher ISO’s. I find it really good at ISO 100 and usable at ISO 200. Above it is all a different game.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/1.9, 1/48 sec, 21mm equivalent, ISO 400, -0.3 EV
The closest rival besides the DP1 and the GX200 is the Panasonic Panasonic DMC-LX3. It has a 24 to 60mm lens and a maximum aperture of f/2.0! This is a very popular camera world wide. I tried it and found the high dynamic B&W setting fantastic. I didn’t like the typical Panasonic jog dial and you need to use Silkypix to get the best results from the camera for the RAW files since a lot of correction is taking place on the files. I didn’t like it that the camera constantly reseted itself after the power was turned off. But firmware version 2.0 has just been released and the last used zoom and menu setting will be resumed after you turn the power on again. A great new added feature and it shows the commitment Panasonic makes for this camera and its users.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/1.9, 1/1320 sec, 28mm equivalent, ISO 64, -0.3 EV
To other contenders are the very popular Canon Powershot G11 which actually has the same sensor as the GR Digital III. some regard this camera as a brick, but has a pretty old school user interface and a decent lens starting at 28mm (, but f/2.8). Canon’s second camera is the new S90 which shares the same technology as the G11, but has an even faster lens starting at f/2.0 and a very interesting user interface with a lens ring that can be used for several camera changes.
And of course, not to be forgotten, there are some cameras still around there which could be considered obsolete by today’s standards, like the former Ricoh GR Digital II or the even older GR Digital I. Although the latter one is really much harder to find.
In the end though I really have been impressed by the Ricoh GR Digital III and can recommend it for those who are interested in a camera that has some of the best user interfaces and is designed with photography in mind.
Ricoh GR Digital III, f/4.5, 1/400 sec, 21mm equivalent, ISO 64, +1.0 EV
Other reviews and information about the Ricoh GR Digital III
One of the first reviews posted was on Alpha Mount World by Carl Garrard. Pavel Kudrys at Ricohforum.com is regularly posting some of the tests he is conducting including comparisons with other Ricoh cameras, including the Ricoh GR Digital II. And a new review of the GR Digital III is expected soon by Cristian Sorega who has been using the camera for quite some time. He will be comparing the GR Digital III too to the first and previous GR Digital. And for many GR Digital III photographs you might want to check the Ricoh GR Digital III group.
All photographs by Wouter Brandsma
Filed under: 2009, Photography | 73 Comments
Tags: GRD3, GRDIII, impressions, Ricoh, Ricoh GR Digital III
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Great review. Thanks for sharing your impressions. I also think that the Panasonic GF1 with pancake lens is an interesting camera. Not a fixed lens but probably also to be considered.
Thank you Marco, but in the article I am referring to high quality compact cameras with fixed lenses. While the GF1 looks like an interesting camera I won’t classify it in the same class. And not only because it has an interchangeable lens system, but also as a result of used materials.
For the price however some people will certainly take the GF1 into consideration when they compare it with the GR Digital III.
Thanks for sharing, Wouter! Nice personal opinion/review.
Just love your black and white photos! Wonderful techniques, if you ever feel like sharing a how-to-before-after-kinf-of-post, I’ll be very happy.
I am considering some writing about B&W conversion techniques Hans, but not sure how.
The real question is will you miss it after it’s gone? I got a GRD3, shot with it for a week then had to use my DSLR for a week and boy did I miss the GRD3. I am so hooked on the snap focus function that I don’t even want to shoot anything else.
I added some text to my article Jeff. But yes, I will absolutely miss the GRD3. The snap focus function and the fast lens are so good.
Thanks for the thoughtful analysis. I love the images in this post. I use Lightroom for most of my GRD3 processing because I’ve been using it for a lot of family snapshots (it’s faster), but every now and then I use RAW Developer when I want to really work an image. The GRD3 remains my favorite camera and I wish other camera companies would put such a focus on the user experience and customizability. I hope this category of camera expands.
Keep up the good work and I hope you continue to enjoy the GRD3.
You’re welcome Andrew. For quickies I used Lightroom too. I am not worried about the extra image quality when the family snapshots are printed at normal consumer size. I use RAW Therapee for anything beyond normal usage.
Enjoy your GRD3.
Excellent review Wouter!
I agree with your observations and you basically said everything I was going to say in my review, might have to change it now.
I hope not Cristian. I still would love to read your review.
Great review, great camera.
I think the best part is that if you are serious into compact camera photography, there are a few wonderful cameras to choose from. We have to thank Ricoh, Leica, Panasonic and Sigma for their constant efforts to produce some high-quality photography tools.
I still miss the presence of Olympus and Nikon (I did mention Canon in my list). And Nikon did an outstanding job with the Nikon 28/35Ti in the Nineties. But maybe we are the dawn of a new era.
Many thanks for your review also from me, Wouter. I also like your photos. Just one question: there are lots of remarks, in reviews as well as in forums, and from you as well, that the image quality, especially for high ISO, of the LX3 is the best around, and better than the GRDIII. I have checked many reviews and full size pictures from the LX3 by now and I have to say that I do not understand these claims. Already at ISO400 if not lower values, there is a lot of banding, and not just in underexposed areas and lots of detail is lost. I understand that when it came out, the LX3 was something really special and I believe that it is a good camera. But it seems to me that the new sensor in the Canons and the GRDIII is much better regarding sensitivity. I also have the impression that the “soft” output you get with GRDIII is the price you pay for recovering much more detail in low contrast and underexposed areas, ie that Ricoh went for a more conservative approach in post processing because it had different priorities than other manufacturers. This is not an issue of a “bad jpeg engine” but of different goals. Could it be that the engine is just good at different things? But in any case, regarding the comparisons to the LX3, I cannot see any advantage regarding IQ. What do you think?
Hi Klaus, I have used the LX3 recently, so I was able to compare some photographs. The LX3 isn’t really special at base ISO, but creates pretty good jpegs at higher ISO. I think they have a pretty clever noise reduction algorithm for the jpeg pipeline and the sharpness is clearly there without being to aggressive. I did however think that the RAW images from the GRD3 were nicer (although these are still softer than those from the GX200).
I do agree with you that Ricoh probably had different priorities in mind with the jpeg engine. Maybe less pleasing for those interested in 100% pixel peeping, but more focused on pleasant looking dynamic range. While Canon and Panasonic went for more sharpness in my opinion.
There are maybe a few other factors at stake. It is said that Canon and Ricoh both use the same Sony sensor. But Canon likely targets their cameras for a larger crowd than Ricoh. The primary target of Ricoh is still the domestic market of Japan (very enthusiastic photographers with a preference for cult and history), although they want to expand to the West. Canon is more focused to the West, and I think more photographers here relate image quality to sharpness. Canon has probably also more engineers working on the software for their cameras.
But what is IQ? For me it is pleasing dynamic range and no smearing as a result of noise reduction. For others IQ is all about sharpness and no noise. I like noise, many don’t.
I give you an interesting example. Back focusing with lenses is something that has always happened. Was it a real issue in the past when we still used film? No, because you could hardly see it on a print. Nowadays people do judge their work more often at 100% and do now notice imperfections with their lenses/system and complain about it (It happened with some Leica M lenses that became a real issue when the M8 arrived). Softness in the corners is the same thing. Need a real issue for real photography, but became an issue as result of the rigorous testing.
And banding does unfortunately also happen with the images from the GRD3, but isn’t so much an issue for me. I am not so much interested in shadow details.
Hi Wouter,
Thanks for your really detailed answer. It is nice to see that someone is reading my post. This applies for you even more with the review I guess:-)
I think I agree with your preferences on image quality. Maybe I chose the wrong term, I do not know if it is really banding what I meant. Maybe it’s more smearing. I do not see the point of not having pure, naturally (film-like) looking noise, similar to grain, but replacing is with really ugly smearing which looks totally artificial. I’m just curious: If you look at this image (ISO400, full size, http://www.flickr.com/photos/24082504@N06/3910594208/sizes/o/) you see these artifacts everywhere, on the trees in the corners, very strong on the skin of the persons. Is this banding or just smearing? I did not see things like that in GRDIII images at ISO400 and hardly at ISO800. I am not a fan of pixel-peeping but I just feel that the GRDIII seems to be a really good camera, not only the optics but also signal processing and electronics, and if a small company does well in this area where it is generally assumed that only the big ones have enough resources to be successful, I think they should get the credit for it. It is somehow nice to support an underdog, even more if this is based on actual merits and many people will base their buying decision on such criteria. It is a bit like the megapixel race which now seems to be over. It took a long time until the mainstream opinion changed but now even Canon seems to have changed their priorities in this area. In a german magazine, fotomagazin(.de), they had a comparison of different small “enthusiast” cameras, based on labtests (although they do not explain how they measured what:-), but it is a DCTau test which seems to be serious. They said they were surprised by the low resolution compared to other cameras (although it was still good), but this might be explained by the very low incidence of artifacts. In fact, on a scale from 1 to 6: the artifact mark of the GRDIII was 1.5, while the others were DP2 2.0, nikon p6000 3.5, Canon G10 and Panasonic LX3 4.0. However, I had had this impression myself before reading the review, just from looking at pictures, so I thought there might be something to it:-)
Don’t be worried. I read every comment. The image you tried to refer me, wasn’t there anymore. From other images I have seen in his stream they display pretty good IQ from a technical point of view. Remember that these sensors are so tiny and development has come a long way.
I know fotomagazin and they always conduct very technical comparisons in my opinion. Too technical in my opinion. Instead I would suggest you to do some printing. Try to find two ISO 400 images. One with some smearing and/or banding that worries you, and another one that you think is pretty good. Print both these images and compare the outcome.
The other option is to reduce both images to normal websizes like 1024 pixels or 800 pixels. And than observe the images. With digital photography the temptation to view at 100% and judge the IQ is constantly there. And I believe everyone does so, including me. It is just what you will keep as your reality. For me it is printing and websized images. Besides theft it is the most important reason why I don’t share my images at full size on the web. I know people will start to pixel peep and loose thought and feeling of the possible outcome.
I think the GRD3 is a great camera and it is a joy to use. That can’t be analyst by all those test.
Gruß,
Wouter
Thank, Wouter. I got your message. Just regarding the image: You have to remove the bracket at the end, my mistake. The correct link: http://www.flickr.com/photos/24082504@N06/3910594208/sizes/o/
That is smearing Klaus as a result of the noise reduction. All over the place. It won’t look nice as a very large print, but will do fine as 10×15cm print still. But I see your point too. I haven’t seen such smearing with the GRD3.
Yeaaah!:-) Finally somebody to see this! It’s the same with the G10 and even some DSLRs in low contrast areas. I find it surprising that people do not complain more about this as long as their cameras win resolution competitions.
excuse me for jumping into your conversation — but i see it too, klaus, and why it doesn’t bother more people as well…
i am not a pixel peeper, but i do know what i want in my photos and have found Ricoh GRD/GX cameras to leave you more of the real image to play with. whilst they seem to have added some NR to RAW after the original GRD, it is still much less aggressive than other manufacturers do in their RAW.
my hope/dream/wish is that some manufacturer has the cojones to allow the user to turn off ALL noise reduction in RAW… sigh.
Hi cam,
I am actually happy that you join the conversation. I started a thread along these lines on the Ricoh forum last week I think (with a too pathetic post maybe:-), which did not have much resonance. If you (or anybody) is interested: http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1013&message=33118454
I would be happy to hear more opinions on this. By the way, I bought the GRDIII in the meantime.
Klaus
klaus, i will look over there when i get a chance.
in the meanwhile, congrats on the GRDIII!
And congrats with your new camera Klaus. Enjoy it very much.
You know Klaus. This almost looks like the LX2 smearing and I haven’t seen it so bad before with the LX3. Now I don’t know, but either the photographer used noise reduction in-camera or compressed the image before uploading to flickr.
no fun, Wouter! i wanted to see how thin we could make this thread
I kind of like this
This is so much better than any diet!
Cam, you’re right, space is getting quite limited here:-) Thanks to you both for your congratulations. Re LX3: Here is another image from another photographer at ISO400. http://www.flickr.com/photos/34090001@N03/3502349734/sizes/o/
It’s similar I would say. Of course we don’t know how they were processed before, but if they are from different people…
At http://www.pixel-peeper.com you can find pictures by camera for yourself, but probably you know already.
Klaus
great review!
i know i should not be tempted as i own the GRDII, but the faster lens, ability to set shutter speed, and the lovely new options to fine tune Snap make me drool!!!
sigh. i visited Marcel again yesterday and kept on thinking, well — it is my birthday… but i controlled myself, alas. i also got to see GR1 for the first time and drooled.
i honestly think one has to use a Ricoh to understand just how good and intuitive it really is. it becomes an extension of yourself, rather than merely a tool. it is heads and shoulders above the other compacts you mentioned because of its handling, even if there is still too much NR in the RAW files (Ricoh, are you listening?).
(speaking of RAW…. i just put a few shots from the GRDII through C1 — nice! no profile for the Ricoh so the WB was way off (an NYC subway shot), but it seemed even more could be eeked out of the files.)
and, lastly, in favour of the Ricoh GR Digital series. i am still a firm believer in the beauty and simplicity of fixed lenses. IMO, 28mm rock the world! i honestly wish more people would give it a go
Happy birthday to you, happy birthday to you, happy birthday sweet Wilder, happy birthday to you!!!!!!! Congratulations!!!!!!! And that you may keep the ever on-going youth. And thank you Cam for your comment. But I must really thank you for your support and discussions prior to finishing this article.
Don’t try the GRDIII! It will seriously ruin your relationship with your M8 and R-D1
The snap mode with preset focus distances and the fast lens is nothing for you! LOL!
I hope K. doesn’t read this, but go get that camera. Try to sell your GRDII. Or better yet, start taping the name of your camera, before you get the GRDIII and when you get the GRDIII tape that one too. He won’t notice the differences. Tell him the S on the mode dial has always been there. Come on, he thinks Canon and Olympus are doing a good job
Ciao W.
Great review Wouter! And really fantastic images! You managed to extract some really great B&W photos from GRDIII! Well done!
Thanks Pavel. Some of the photographs were RAW images, some other B&W jpegs. The bird photograph and the photograph with the two girls (including my daughter
) and the chimneys are original B&W photographs with contrast set to +2 and sharpness to +1.
Hey Wouter – thanks for sharing your thoughts on the compact cameras you highlighted. I know very little about these cameras and I like to read your thoughts as it brings everything into perspective. I get my questions asked even the ones I didn’t know I had
I do not know much about compacts but I will say that I am a huge fan of fixed focal length lenses on any type of camera. I think it adds a lot to the experience and the photography. I am not sure how to articulate how but it just does. I think the action of moving around your subject makes for better photographs.
You have some great captures here as well. I think if I did use small sensor compacts this camera would be one that I would select as my tool
Happy shooting…
You should really try such a camera John. Feel the differences with your Pentax. Notice that people react differently too. And Tammi might like it too
Despite all the available zoom lenses there is still much to be said for prime lenses.
Bravo Wouter, your review is very informative and a pleasure to read and you are a very talented photographer as your pictures show.
Thanks for sharing.
Many thanks Francois.
To be honest i didnt read the review, just looked at the photos, and i really like them, excellent photos…congratulations…
Aren’t photographs what it is all about? Thank you Carlos.
Very enjoyable Wouter,pictures and text.I presume the 40mm lens wont fit,do you think they”ll bring out a new version?……..all the best ,Neil
Hi Neil, Thanks for passing by. The 40mm lens does fit with a step-down ring. Some vignetting does occur, but I personally think it isn’t so bad. You might want to see and read what Pavel Kudrys of ricohforum posted about it.
I personally don’t think Ricoh will come with a new version (yet). I just doubt it, but I could be wrong. I will ask them though.
All the best too,
Wouter
Very thoughtful review, Wouter — and excellent photographs!
What concerns me the most is what you write about the softness the GRD3 DNG files, even compared to those of the GX200. While I don’t know the latter, I found that GX100 DNG files were much softer than those of the GRD and GRD2 and required much more aggressive sharpening than the latter two cameras, and usually more contrast increase as well. This is a cause of concern because I often like to “beat up” files and push the contrast a lot; and this often means that softer files — like those of the GX100 — have more of a limit as to what I could do with them than GRD/GRD2 files and that ultimately means less flexibility and usually a smaller proportion of pictures that can look like I want them to.
—Mitch/Potomac, MD
Hi Mitch,
Knowing your work and how you like to process your photographs I understand your concern. I can’t unfortunately refer to images from the GRDI and GRDII. My experience is that I think that the GX100 DNG files were actually pretty good and even better than the GX200 DNG’s. First of all the GX100 DNG’s can take sharpening really well. Secondly my process technique for B&W conversion has been mostly related to changing the luminance of individual color channels. For instance making the blue colors darker (like using a red filter in front of the camera) and green colors brighter. What I noticed with the DNG’s from the GX200 and the GRD3 is that there is more noise in the blue and red channel (much more than with the GX100) which negatively affected my conversion techniques. I got blotches sooner in the skies and skin tones and banding in the shadows. This also happens with the GRD3 DNG’s.
My personal experience is that flatter files give more flexibility in post processing, but only when the images are exposed right. I also find it easier to add contrast to flatter images, than to make contrasty images more contrasty. Maybe it has to do with the noise floor in darker and brighter parts.
But to be fair and honest. I haven’t found the softness to be the major problem. My main problem has been the noise floor in the blue and red channels of the images. But that has also been my concern with the images from the GX200. Maybe something distinctive of the Sony sensors being used (I am not sure, but think that the GRD2 and the GX200 also used Sony sensors since they have some of the same characteristics).
And you need more careful post processing. Therefore I started using RAW Therapee in combination with Photoshop, instead of just using Lightroom.
I will try to get back to this subject sometime and demonstrate some of these issues.
Cheers,
Wouter
Very interesting, Wouter. I don’t know how to translate your experience with the GRD3 to what it would mean for me because I have never gone into individual channels. With the GRD2 I ended up using Aperture/Silver Efex, which gave me easily the tonality that I wanted. And you’re right, when the exposure is spot-on fairly contrasty files are good, but when more severe adjustments are necessary less contrasty and flatter files are better to start with. I tend now to have the raw converter, in this case Aperture, produce a fairly flat file before going into Silver Efex. Have you tried Silver Efex on GRD3 files? I suppose I should download some GRD3 files and try, but am very lazy in this respect…do you have any GRD3 for download?
While found that GX100 files are robust and can take a lot of sharpening, I found that generally GRD2 files, for me, brought me a larger proportion of pictures that looked like I wanted them to. For example, I couldn’t imagine that I would get the effect of this GRD2 picture with the GX100:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/malland/2289152354/sizes/o/in/set-72157603989168260/
—Mitch/Potomac, MD
I use Silver Efex too, but not always. I use RAW Therapee now as RAW converter which does a very conventional conversion with less saturation and creates more flat images. These are great to edit in Photoshop. I will sent you a PM with a GRD3 DNG this weekend.
Just want to echo everyone else here Wouter. Very informative review and you have some outstanding B&Ws.
Thank you James. Have a nice weekend!
Thanks for the review wouter. I found your images very inspiring! Re the camera, it would be very nice to get the same but with 35 or 40 or even 50mm lens, lots of people are used to work with this focals from our old slrs… Or lets imagine a mini system based on this camera with a choice of fast fixed focal lens: 21, 35, 50, 100… Well, i think i should sleep a bit more today… By the way, i bought a gx100 a bit influenced by your pictures (imo your collection of pictures with the gx100 is the best on the net) and i’m really happy with it! Is a real pleasure to use the ricoh cameras.
I hope you enjoy your GX100 as much as I did, Jordi. A lovely camera!
I personally hope for a mini system. Compact camera body and 2 small lenses would be really nice. A 28 and 50 or 40 (both fast lenses of course). I hope Ricoh reads this too
ooooh! did somebody say fast?
Hey, faster than f/2.0!
Thank you for this very detailled in depth review Wouter!
It’s very interesting to read about the different Raw tools you use. How did you find out about the best tool/camera combinations?
Another thing I’m curious about is the post-processing technique you use. I like the dynamic contrast and softness in your pictures.
At the moment I mainly use my LX3 to shoot in JPG, the builtin coverter is very good. But I’m considering to shoot in Raw also and do the post-processing in CS3 & Nik Silver Efex. I hope you can find some time to tell me more about your post-processing.
Thank you Piet. It is just trying. And so can you. You mention having CS3 so you have the option of Adobe ACR. Secondly you have Lightroom. Thirdly, you’ve got the LX3 which you get with Silkypix. And RAW Therapee can be downloaded for free.
It will take more time for me to produce some articles about post-processing, but I might start some series for later this fall and/or the winter. I will think about it, Piet.
A well-written review, Wouter – thank you! I am still enjoying my GRD-2; it’ll be a year old in December. As much as the f/1.9 of the GRD-3 tempts me, I will allow at least a couple of new models to go by before upgrading. Recently, I purchased an E-P1, with a view to completely replacing my Canon dSLR gear. Despite the huge novelty value in having a new camera like that around (not to mention the double novelty value of mounting a bunch of old screwmount lenses on it), I still carry the GRD everywhere and use it every day. It’s just so intuitive and reliable – I know exactly what I’m going to get from it. I cannot imagine ever abandoning it – it’s always with me.
Hi Kai. A year old is still a year young. Even though some feature enhancements are really nice with the GRD3 I still think the GRD2 is still a perfectly fine camera. I guess the strength for the GRD is a perfect camera to have with you all the time.
Hello Wouter,
i enjoyed your review and pictures very much. Perhaps this tool is my next camera – perhaps,time will tell,so long i take my pictures with my ricoh caplio gx, the first ricoh gx model.
Best regards, titus
As long as your current camera is still fine and challenges you enough, than there is no need to have another camera in my opinion. But the simplicity from a photographers point of view with a fixed prime lens is tempting.
Cheers,
Wouter
Hi wouter,
Thanks for that interesting read! In fact it is a bit in contradiction from what i concluded myself out of the sample pitures. But, I am fully aware that you as a user have valid point about the softness.. That is a bit of a let down?
I do agree, more and more, that we should focus on the print or a ‘print size’ view on screen.
As i am still wanting a good 35mm, or 40mm view compact camera, it is still a toss between a dp2 or…. yes what? a gx100? 200, a newer ricoh, that is on the horizon still? I would prefer not to use a zoom (for better aperture reasons).
I also had very good experiences with that powerfull Raw Therapee (with canon files), in fact you had to be carefull not to destroy details…
best!
ronald
Hi Ronald,
Probably the contradiction is within the consensus developers have to accomplish. The noise reduction is there with the GRD3, all ISO settings for the jpegs despite camera settings (there is in fact a noise reduction off). But it isn’t as aggressive, but maybe does cause softness. Of course I would have liked to see no noise reduction at all, but what they did now is still better than all the heavy smearing. I just hope they can improve it with a new firmware.
Waiting is still the best option Ronald. Other cameras will come that will come close to your DP1 IQ expectations.
Have a nice weekend.
Just want to congratulate you on your work, great stuff.
I’m a huge fan of compacts, though I use DSLR for most of my “paid” work.
These lens looks pretty sweet wide open.
The lens is incredible. An impressive piece of engineering.
I love and hate your pics Wouter. I hate them because now I want a GRDIII too! Did you really buy the camera at Amazon, or do you know a website in the Netherlands (or EU) where I can buy one? All the best Wouter!
Hoi Kees,
The camera was supplied by Ricoh Europe and I got it for just testing. I haven’t seen any shop here in the Netherlands that actually has the camera in stock. The camera is available at Amazon.com or popflash.com, but still difficult to get in Europe. Even the Ricoh eshop in Europe doesn’t have the camera!
I will contact my contactperson for more information about the availability.
excuse me for butting in, but i know Marcel has some in stock — i was just there today.
L’Instantané
40, Boulevard Beaumarchais
75011 Paris, France
+33 1 43 55 02 32
+33 1 43 55 49 32 FAX
ask for Marcel
He speaks quite good english, but it’s always harder on the telephone — speak slowly… you can tell him a friend of Cam’s sent you.
(Wouter knows how to reach me if you need a go-between.)
Thank you for providing this information, Cam. And according to Cam the best support in town.
Thank you Cam! The more I read about this camera, the more I want it.
you’re welcome, Kees!
the more i think about it and touch it at Marcel’s, the more i want it too… it honestly has so many features that i, as an original GRD and GRDII owner clamored for. nad the new lens is breath-taking! Ricoh, more than most manufacturers out there, seem to listen to their customer base.
if it was my only camera, i would have upgraded in a heartbeat. as it is, i am shooting mostly rangefinders these days, so getting one is not quite as justifiable.
i am still mightily tempted, however. it’s winter and my coat has the perfect pocket for it
the more i look at the images from the GRDIII, the more they remind me of the magic that the first GRD had. sigh… this really is a little beauty!
Wonter, You are the pro !
To wouter
sorry, I type wrong name QQ
No problem Mookio
Great Review! One quick question since I’m driving myself crazy between this camera and the Panasonic LX3…
The lens difference aside (fixed vs zoom), is the camera build quality, ease of use (dials for GRD vs joystick for LX3), and image quality worth the difference in cost between The GRD3 and LX3 (among other advanced compact cameras)?
I personally think it is. I would describe the GRD3 as an honest camera. The lens is really spectacular for a compact camera. And I can’t get used to the joystick interface of the Panasonics. The GRD user interface is really logical to me and I can operate the camera with one hand without looking.
Thanks for the quick reply. I feel the same about this as well, one tends to take better pictures when the camera has a better interface, it seems. I think I can see the GRD3 in my near future.
Thank you for the excellent review Wouter – I have been looking for a digital compact to complement my Leica M4-P (mostly since I no longer have time or space to develop my own film to any great extent) and thanks to your images and your words I have decided upon the GRD III. Really looking forward to getting started with it, can’t wait for my sister to come home from Singapore with a black little box